hate

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I hate men. I hate the games that have to be played with them.I hate the fact that they want women so bad sexually, if you have sex with them too quickly, they leave. It hurts so bad. I hate to think of how many men I have had sex with (only because I desire intimacy/closeness) and KNOW that I meant nothing to them (and vice versa). I’ve only had 2 real boyfriends, but several partners.

I hate the way men try to give you the bare minimum, but will take everything if you allow them to. The other day I was texting with a guy that likes me and I told him that I had gotten laid off of my job. He then says, “oh, you’re at home?” After I tell him yes, he proceeds to ask me if he can come over and watch tv with me. Call me crazy, but that made me so so angry! He has never ever invited me out to dinner, lunch, a movie, bowling, or any other type of date, but he wants to come over my house, kick off his shoes, watch my cable on my tv, sitting on my couch, in my house, where I don’t even know how I’m going to pay rent at this month. If there is one thing I know about men (especially those that will invite themselves over to your place of residence, or you to theirs) they want to try to establish some false sense of intimacy with you, put their arm around you, touch your leg, try to kiss you, eventually hoping it will lead to sex. All without them ever having to spend a dime on a damn date.

I hate men who approach me who are way out of their league. And I get so frustrated with myself for being so damn polite to them, and not wanting to hurt their feelings.

I hate how I have to pretend not to like the guys that I’m really interested in, knowing that if I pretend that I couldn’t care less about them, they will chase me to the ends of the earth. But if I am genuine and authentic, and show that I like them, they really aren’t interested. It’s the most unnatural thing in the world to pretend as if you don’t like someone when you actually do.

For every man that I have ever had sex with, I hate you. I hate you for making me feel worthless in your eyes, when I was simply trying to share a part of myself with you. I hate you for making me doubt myself. I hate you for making me have such a negative outlook on men. I hate you for making me cry. I hate you for not even making the sex worth my time.

This post was submitted by monykah.

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  • Caz

    @ Greece
    Thank you for sharing your story and for being so honest with us. At one time you were so consumed with hate for men you were ready to kill…that is so bad, but thank god you saw the light in time and got through it. I don’t want to hate men that much, in fact i don’t want to hate men at all. When we hate it shows that we fear, and why must we fear men? Most of them are small minded egocentric pathetic numb brain dick heads. We can outwit them. We can outsmart them. We can be one step ahead of them and their stupid little games. There is no way I would allow a man to ruin my life. I use men as my stepping stones to get ahead in life, and i use them as people to practice my assertive skills on, that’s it. I have no feelings for them. I don’t care about them. I only care about women – men are nothing to me. And my god, is a woman. I get turned on by strong independent successful intelligent women, that’s what I’m looking for.

  • Greece

    Kyra

    “Men cheat on us with cancer and die”
    Sorry, but that wasnt funny at all. Watching someone you love die day by day and there is nothing you can do is the hardest thing I have ever had to go though.

  • Caz

    Greece, I’m sure Kyra didn’t mean to hurt you with her words. She was just venting her anger for men in general. Our hate hurts others, doesn’t it.

    I am so not looking forward to going into work today and being gawped at by that sex predator on the loose. I think my problem is because I have long blonde hair and look young and pretty, men like him seem to think i’m a soft touch and can easily be taken advantage of. Also, I work in an old people’s home and have to wear a uniform, which he told me turns him on. Disgusting prick. Every time I see him, I just feel so sick. Listen to this song – http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jzmf7ZJRI9M – it reminds me of him.

  • Caz

    Is it just me, or do men accuse you of being shy and quiet in order to intimidate you, and gain information out of you in order to further manipulate you? From now on, I am not telling any man anything about myself. They don’t deserve to know nothing.

  • Kyra

    No Greece it had no intention to hurt you…

    But it’s interesting that you took to heart that part, and completely ignored the part where i told you he was an angel…

    But it’s ok, if you took it wrong from me,but I’d still say that line and I still think your story is great!

    I’m sorry for your loss and pain, I am not sorry for that line, sorry!

  • Kyra

    And btw… angels don’t cheat!

  • Heather

    I hate men, all the way down to my core. I hate men that are married. On a few accounts I have successfully ruined a marriage by making the wife think their husband was cheating on her with me. I send cards to the house, make up stories.

    I even got a guy to commit suicide. Well he was about to anyways, he was on the bridge and I told him that he should, that no one would love him, that the world is worthless. And he did.

    I will sometimes get into a relationship with a guy just so I can break his heart and ruin him. I find a guy I think will be easy to ruin, and for a few months I date him, acting like I like him, but I tearing him down bit by bit. Then finally I tell him I am leaving him because I am dating so and so now, and pleases me in ways he never could.

    I often dream of cutting a guys dick off, just to watch him scream. I think I might just do that someday.

    I get told that I am a cold heartless bitch, and you know what, I am proud of that. The only way women can survive this world of men is to be cold and heartless.

  • Kyra

    @Caz & Greece

    Ah! I really apreciatted Caz coming for my aid (Thank you Caz!)
    -She was right that it wasn’t done to hurt you Greece, but that line was actually saying that it is unfair that when a woman like you finnally finds a good man, it’s sad that (in your case) he had to die!- So, it wasn’t about venting hate.
    In spite of all that you are probably going through, I think you had more luck for meeting him, then most women will, for never meeting that kind of love! .
    -That’s why I don’t regret what i said…

  • Caz

    Kyra,

    I think it is easy for people to misunderstand things when just reading words and not looking at body language and hearing voice tone. It is easy to take things the wrong way, especially when one is hurt and in so much emotional pain, but I am sure she really appreciates you trying to clear the misunderstanding up. I agree with you, she did meet an angel, the kind of man most women can only dream of meeting. But most of us, unlucky ones, only get to meet men of our worst nightmares.

    But luckily for me, I don’t ever have to worry about getting involved with men again : ))

  • Caz

    Greece & Heather

    Can you share with us just why you hate men so much. You are murderous towards them, or used to be, and Heather you mentioned how you want to cut a guys dick off just for fun – can you tell us why you feel that way? What happened to you?

  • Heather

    @Caz

    Started when my father raped me, and a few friends did the same when I was a kid. But where I got my lust for hating men was when I set them on fire in their cabbin in the woods. Hearing them scream was the best sound I have ever heard.

    I decided that all men needed to pay for what they do to women. Men are all the same, they want to hurt you and laugh about it. Well if we get to them first and hurt them or ruin them, then we wont get hurt ourselves.

    Being cold and heartless makes you stronger. It has made me stronger.

  • Caz

    @ Heather

    OMG! What happened to the men in the cabin? Did they get out in time? Does it really make you feel better to cause them pain? I’m so sorry for what you dad did to you, that is horrific. Men really are shit and on such a low level. Personally, I don’t want to exist on their level. I wish to rise above them and be so much smarter and better than them. Could you ever be intimate with a man? Are you a lesbian too ? I prefer to be cold and heartless too, it does make one stronger and better able to deal with men.

  • Heather

    Caz

    They didnt make it out because I baricaded the door and windows. We were miles and miles away from any people, that was the cabbin that they would take me to and rape me in. Only fitting that it would be the same cabbin that I sent them to hell in. Their frantic attempts to get out still to this day makes me laugh.

    My greatest pleasure in life is watching or making men suffer. Physically and mentally. If I had it my way I would send all men to concentration camps.

    I only have sex with men to manipulate them. They are easy to manipulate when sex is involved. Men are weak minded. I dont even consider them human.

  • Caz

    Personally I believe in karma, what goes around, comes around. I’m not gonna commit any bad karma over a man, cos none of them are worth it. They are not in even worth thinking about. They are nothing to me.

  • Heather

    Caz

    Ruining a man’s life is nothing more then treating an infection. Men are not humans, they are a cancer. When you treat a cancer you dont get bad karma.

    Men are guilty from the moment they are born. And if there is a hell, all men are sent there with no exceptions. I think of myself as just cleaning up the trash.

    Men should fear us, every man from child to old should be afraid of women. We are the superior ones. We are the keepers of life, while men are the creators of death. If we got rid of men, there would be no wars, no sickness, no pain. We would be living in a paradise.

    I hate that the name “woman” has man in it. Men want to own us and control our every thoughts, then throw us into the trash. All men are the same, there are no exceptions. Any man that is nice will hurt you. So you must hurt them first before they hurt you.

    Men will learn their place in due time.

  • Caz

    I agree with you Heather, but I just can’t understand how you can have sex with them! I know you do it to manipulate and play with them but if you was a true man hater you would not want a man to touch you. Just the thought of a man touching me makes me feel physically sick. Many of them have horrible diseases and they enjoy going around impregnating innocent trusting women purely for fun. They don’t give a shit about the consequences.

    Don’t you feel sick when you’re having sex with a man? They are like cancer, rotten cancer…uurgh

  • Heather

    I have learned that there are somethings you just have to do to win the war.
    But I only have sex with those who are very insecure, and most of the time most I do is let them see my breats.

    I always focus on the goal, ruin them. I would cut off my own arm if it would get rid of men.

    But I used to think the same way, never let them touch me ever. It took a while for me to be able to do with without feeling sick to my stomach. A whole mind over matter. It takes a lot of practice. It is basically a nessesary evil. For me at least. I always make sure they are clean.

    I once got a man in jail by breaking my own arm and planting heroin in his house. I am very dedicated to my cause.

  • Rebecca

    @ Heather:

    Although I can completely understand that you burned the cabin with your rapists in it, I wouldn’t go around and tell that on the internet, if I were you. You never know who reads this. A case like this is easy to track back, whether it was ruled as an accident or as foul play. With things like this, I can imagine authorities try to track your IP-number and you could get arrested for it.

    Second, I agree with your men hatred (otherwise I wouldn’t be on this site myself). But I really don’t think it would do you any good on the long term if you go out and ruin people. You need to ruin people who deserve it. Even though I hate the majority of the men, I don’t lose sight of the fact that there might be a few good ones out there. Like my younger brother. He’s really a good guy and he never hurt one girl in his life on purpose. He has the utmost respect for women – and if a guy like him would be ruined by a woman on purpose, he really wouldn’t deserve that. And I’m pretty sure there are a few other ones out there like him. Maybe not much, but only a few is enough.
    The same story is with my son. He’s 10 years old now and he’s an amazingly sweet little boy. I sure as hell wouldn’t want him to meet a woman like you when he’s 20. I do hate men, but of course I don’t hate my son (or my father or my brother for that matter). I wouldn’t want my son to be afraid of me just because he is a man. I just focus on teaching him to respect women, and give him a good example, it’s the only thing I can do.

    You say you only sleep with the insecure ones…mostly they are the guys that are weaker. It’s a bit too easy to only pick on people weaker then you. Why don’t you ruin the players, the psychopaths? At least they deserve it. There’s no game in ruining people that are already on the edge (like the suicide guy) and give them the last push to fall over the edge. It’s too easy.

    Third, I don’t wanna come off like a Mrs. know-it-all, but I honestly do think you might need some help. Therapy, psychologists, anything. Cause this amount of hatred is really not healthy anymore, most of all not for yourself. You can’t be a happy, free, relaxed person if hate tears you up so much. If this is the sole purpose of your life, all the men that abused you have won after all, because they succeeded in destroying all the good in you. You wouldn’t want to give them that victory, would you?

    Don’t get me wrong, I hate men as well and I’m certainly not saying you should be a sweet, nice and smiling woman or degrade yourself to be a man’s slave. I wouldn’t want that either for myself, and I also like to crush men’s egos sometimes if I’d get the chance. Just because they suck and because they’ve hurt me as well. But I wouldn’t go this far. Getting a man in jail by breaking your own arm and planting heroin in his house, is really not a healthy kind of revenge anymore. That sounds more like personality disorder-revenge driven by such an amount of hate and rage, that it will eventually destroy you instead of t hem.

  • Caz

    Rebecca, you are so intelligent …I think I’m in love with you. I agree with everything you say. But to be honest, no offence Heather, I don’t believe you or take you seriously. I can’t believe that somebody could actually do those things and then admit it on the internet, where, like Rebeccas says, you could be tracked down and made to pay for your crimes you have proudly admitted to. I think you have some serious issues to work on before they destroy you. No man is worth you turning into an angry twisted hateful person. Sometimes we have to let our past go and move on, and try to see the good in others. I know its hard, but your hate has consumed you, ate you up, and turned you into a nasty viscous person intent on causing as much pain, even to innocent people. Is that what your time on earth is for? To put as much negative energy out there because of your own pain? These men aren’t worth that. We have to rise above them. Be better than them. Be smarter than them. Stick our fingers up at them and show them how we don’t need them for anything. I’m currently looking for a beautiful, intelligent, professional woman to be in a relationship with. I want an ambitious woman who has goals and drive and energy. Someone who is kind, caring and fun to be around with and enjoys life. I love women. I can’t be bothered hating men anymore. They are not worth my time or energy, they really aren’t. They are nothing to me.

  • Rebecca

    @ Caz:

    I agree with everything you say. I also had my doubts at first to the stories of Heather, but I mostly just give people the benefit of the doubt. If it’s a faker, at least he (cause then it’s probably a man) will see that we are not all home-wrecking bitches that are only out to give a man trouble.
    I might hate them, but it’s still MY responsibility how I want to deal with that. And indeed, I don’t want to degrade myself to the same level, and treat people the same way men treated me. Okay, sometimes I like it to act bitchy when men are hitting on me in a bar or on the street…and look at him like “you’re nothing to me, scumbag, I hate you”. But that’s as far as it goes for me. I don’t want to put all my energy into destroying a man, hell no. Especially not when I think of all the things I gain do for MYSELF with that same amount of energy!

    In some way Heather’s story woke me up. No way I want to become so consumed by my hatred for men. They’re not worth so much effort, cause then my life would still be as it was before: all about men, only now not because of love, but because of hate. But still…all about them! And this time it has to be all about me. I owe that to myself.

    I will have some ups and downs, because a part of me still loves my ex and that’s not always an easy thing to handle – but it’s still not an excuse not to focus on myself. You can love somebody AND focus on yourself and the goals you want to achieve at the same time. One thing doesn’t exclude the other.
    So no more excuses for me….I’m going for me. And besides, sometimes I think it’s not even such a bad thing to still love an ex…at least it prevents you from falling for the next screwed up man that will cause you pain. :-) (although I must admit, my ex was a good guy, not a scumbag who didn’t love me at all)
    But the next man will probably be a scumbag who doesn’t love me at all – cause that’s how the majority of men treat women. So maybe it’s not such a bad way of protection after all: my heart is safe like this, it can’t be given away and in the meantime I can recover and focus only on myself and the things I want to achieve in life. I’m actually looking forward to my future. I feel very, very bitter at certain moments, but at least I have a future now. Ten years ago I had no perspectives at all, but now I can at least look forward to a nice and challenging job that really interests me.

    I want my time on earth to be for something good. I might not be able to get totally rid of my hatred for men, but I sure as hell won’t let it turn me into a person that enjoys causing pain to others. That wouldn’t be a person I look straight into the eyes when I look into the mirror. And in the end, isn’t it all about how you see yourself?

  • Caz

    @Rebecca

    Wow. You are so amazing. I’m very impressed by your new positive outlook. I think Heather gave me a shocking wake up call too. I don’t ever want to be like her, sorry, no offence Heather. But that is my worst fear to end up a hateful bitter woman intent on causing pain to men. You are right Rebecca, we must focus on loving ourselves and respecting and appreciating our bodies. Yes, we can still have high standards and know what type of person we’d like to meet one day, and spend our time with, but our experiences from the past have made us much stronger and wiser. In future, we will be very smart and careful about who we choose to put our time and energy into. But if we already love ourselves we will never let anybody treat us like rubbish again. And I promise you, your hate for your ex will fade over time, and you will look back at the good memories and smile without bitterness in your heart. I’m so glad you have found a challenging job which interests you and raises your self-esteem. xxx

  • Cindyd

    If they have one of those hanging things between their legs…….I don’t trust them period. I never thought my sweet little boy would turn into a 15 year old, arrogant, disrespectful, cocky man, but he’s working on it!

    I had an old lady tell me once, “Get fat and ugly and you’ll never have to deal with their selfishness again. Just ignore their rude comments”. She built a cacoon around herself basically. I’ve considered it, but my self esteem is more important to me than that. I’m guess I’m naive somewhat, because being nice is often misconstrued as having…”Let’s Fuck” on my forehead. I’ve tried rude as well. Then I’m labeled a bitch. I can’t win this one. Even older guys I respect and never thought that they would come onto me do just that. It’s gross. I don’t ask for that. I suppose there are women out there that say, “Sure, what about right now, your car or mine?”
    I have gotten to where I’m pretty blunt about saying, “look if you are trying a come on, I’m not interested and offended that you would think that I was. Do I need to call your wife and inform her that you all need some therapy of some sort” I’m just saying.

    I am not normally hateful……..but people in general are so superficial these days. You never know who you can and can’t trust. I trust my dogs to love me no matter, even if I forget to feed them one day. Madonna: Tell me love isn’t true….it’s just something that we do. Men just want to spread their seeds, animals.

  • Caz

    Hi Cindyd

    I am like you, I have self-esteem and I like to look good. I don’t want to turn fat and ugly to keep sexual harassers away, but sometimes i can imagine why women do that. I have also learned, the hard way, that you can’t be nice to men because they take it as ‘i want to have sex with you.’ I mean i’m too scared to even smile at a man now in case he thinks that. You are right, even men old enough to be your father and know better, are disgusting sex predators. They just think about sex all the time and they have no respect whatsoever. They don’t treat us like human beings who might have interesting things to say. If you won’t have sex with them, then they don’t want to know, and some can be very aggressive. Here’s a tip – don’t ever ever believe a man who says he’s happy to just be friends with you because the chances are at the back of his mind he is plotting the many ways he can manipulate you into getting you into bed. They are so fucking selfish. They don’t give a shit about our feelings and what we want from life. It’s just all about them and their happiness. I’ve got to that stage where if a man smiles or talks to me on the street I give him such a viscous look as if to say, ‘back off or i will fucking kill you!” If i have to talk to a man i give them as little information about myself as possible. They have no right to know anything about me.

  • Caz

    Do you know what I just realised about myself…I am a real selfish bitch. I don’t care about any man but myself. Every man that has used and hurt me, I have stabbed them all in the back, and used them to further myself, like simple stepping stones to become stronger, wiser, smarter, and more powerful. I used to be such a nice caring person, but now I am a heartless cold bitch, but i am not ashamed of it. In fact, I am really really proud of it. It’s liberating actually. I am always going to be one step ahead of the bastards and use them for what I can get – not sex though. I can’t stand the thought of having sex with one of them, uurgh, so gross. And I would never use one for money, i much prefer to make my own money in life. I don’t need any man for his money. But when a man talks to me now, and tells me his sob story in order to make me feel sorry for him, i pretend to care, but deep down, i really don’t give a shit. After playing with one for a while, i get bored, and cut them completely out of my life. I ignore them and feel no guilt whatsoever. I think I am such an amazing woman and no man is good enough to touch me. If any man does dare to touch me, I will go mental and not hold back. If i have to hurt somebodys feelings, then so be it.

  • Rebecca

    I’m starting to quit my polite behaviour as well now, Caz. And it feels good!

    Yesterday evening I logged in at some dating website where I used to have a profile for a long time now. Not really to look for a guy (since I’m not a paying member), but just to browse a little bit.

    Some guy invited me to chat and because he seemed to have a friendly face on his photo, I thought “what the heck” and I accepted.

    And guess what….within FIVE minutes I already had my first sex-related comment!! It was astonishing. It’s unbelievable how stupid some men can be. How can someone believe that he will ever get a normal woman when he talks to her like that??

    He started to tell me that I was so hot, that I had such beautiful eyes…pfff, can someone bring me a bucket, so that I can throw up? Oh, and then he asked me if I was into women as well, because “he liked to share me”.

    I was seriously stunned at first, but then I was like: ok, this is NOT the kind of behaviour I want anymore. Of course it happened before to me, in the past, and then I always tried to change the subject, or try to lead the conversation to a more normal level, so that he would stop saying such respectless things that only degrade me to a piece of meat. I didn’t want to be unpolite and just block him.

    And then I thought: “That is gonna change from now on.” So I just closed the chat window and didn’t respond anymore. Half a minute later he sent me a new request and I just pressed the ignore-button. Take a hint, you stupid jerk.

    It might sound like a small thing, but for me it’s big. It’s part of changing my attitude. If a man thinks he can talk to me like that, don’t expect me to put up with it. If you can’t have a normal, decent and respectful conversation with me, then go to hell. I’m not spending a second of my time on you anymore.

    I can tell you, it felt like a great victory. No more Mrs. Nice Girl from now on, especially if people are not nice to me!

    The exact same thing happens from now on with old men that approach me. You’d really be surprised if you could see the amount of 40-50 year old men who send me messages, while I put in my profile that I’m looking for someone between 29 and 36. (I am 31 myself)
    It’s like they’re blind: men from 48 or 53 send me a message. Sometimes they’re even in their 60′s! Seriously, what the hell are you thinking? That you can get a 31-year-old woman when you are 60? Why even try?

    I used to just ignore these scumbags (the polite way of rejection), but now I do it differently. I send them a message back and say: “If you took the time to look at my profile instead of only at my photo, you would’ve seen that you are REALLY too old!”
    I just like to rub it in now, that they are old. Not that I have something against old people, but I DO have something against old men that think they can still hit on a girl that could’ve been their daughter. As if you would succeed! Then you really overestimate yourself – and you deserve it that I rub it in that you are OLD. Deal with it.

    I’m sick of these losers. I have no reason to be polite to them anymore, or spare their feelings. If you consider me to be only a piece of meat, you really lost all the right on my politeness.

  • Caz

    Good for you Rebecca. Girl power! I know what you mean, it is shocking isn’t it, how these lecherous ugly men think they stand a chance with you. They don’t care about your profile, your personality, your character etc. They only care about what you look like, and all they are looking for are easy girls who they can trick and manipulate into getting naked over a webcam. Sadly, there are many naive girls out there looking for love, and they fall for it. But I’m so glad you have seen the light Rebecca, and won’t stand for their sickening disrespectful behaviour. You are so much better than that, and you deserve to meet a man who you can have an intelligent conversation with which doesn’t revolve around sex. These men just make me sick! Can’t they think of anything besides sex? I already know that answer. God, they are just so stupid aren’t they. It is them who are so easy to manipulate. I once had a short ugly guy who pretended to be friends with me until i later realised he was just using me cos he wanted sex with me. Afterwards, i felt so sick that he actually thought he stood a chance with me. I mean, men like him really need to get a mirror and look at themselves properly. They don’t care if you are completely out of their league, they still try anyway. I suppose we should feel sorry for them really.

  • Caz

    Do you know what I remind myself of? A spider that carefully lures the fly into it’s web. Patiently, smartly she awaits it. It gets closer, becomes more trusting, lets it guard down, and then when it reaches the most crucial point …BANG! she stabs it into the back, chews it, and then spits it out. You should all try it. It’s fun!

  • Rebecca

    Haha yeah, some of them are really unrealistic towards themselves. What kind of woman wants a men that is 30 years older then she is?

    The thing is, I have no problem with sex, unless it’s in a committed and respectful relationship. If I am with a man and I really love him, I think it’s great to have sex with him and in that case, I like to do it a lot.
    But I don’t see the use of one night stands…it’s not my thing. I tried it once, when I was 24 or something, and it was a disappointment. Not because of the guy, because he was actually really sweet and attentive towards me, but because I just didn’t feel any love for him. I don’t like to have sex without love, it’s too shallow and clinical. I was thinking about the laundry I had to put in the dryer while we were getting busy, haha….then you seriously know sex without love is not your thing!

    So I never do that. There have been periods in my life where I didn’t have a relationship for something like 1,5 or 2 years – which also means I don’t have sex during 1,5 or 2 years. I don’t mind about that. The first few months it’s a bit hard sometimes, but the longer you are without it, the easier it gets. :-)

    I have thought about putting an uglier photo on my profile, to avoid these guys who only write to you because of your looks, but I decided not to do that. It’s not my fault that I look the way I look. If they think it’s an invitation to behave like I am a piece of meat, they are to blame, not me.

    You know what also makes me sick? Guys that start to make comments about your body. “Oh, you have such a beautiful body, you’re so slim, unbelievable that you had a child”, bla bla bla. If my loving boyfriend tells me that, it’s a great thing to hear. But not if it comes from a regular dude at a bar, who’s almost undressing me with his eyes at the same time. It disgusts me.
    Sometimes I really think the only way to get ride of these stupid talks, is to be fat and ugly. But I don’t wanna be fat and ugly. I’m proud of the way I look (and besides, no matter what I eat, I wouldn’t even succeed in getting fat even if I really wanted it, so that’s not an option anyway).
    But even if it was an option, I wouldn’t wanna do it. The fact that I am thin and that I do my best to look good and attractive, doesn’t mean it’s ok for men to see me as “something out there for the taking”. Some respect please!

    What you write about girls getting naked on a webcam, I really don’t understand why a woman would ever do that. I mean, don’t they really feel stupid at such moments? I would be pretty embarrased of myself if I did that.

    The ‘best friend who just wants to have sex with you’ sounds familiar. I had one like that as well. Stupid enough I fell for it – also because I thought he would never hurt me because we were such good friends. But now that I look back at it, he even was the one that hurt me the most of all. It’s absolutely unbelievable how cruel he has been to me. With such friends, who needs enemies, right?
    It took me 2 years before I could even think about letting a man get close to me or touch me after him.

    Right now I decided I’m just ok with being single. It’s better then constantly being approached by all kinds of stupid men.
    My last relationship ended last summer because of various reasons – but it actually was a good relationship. He treated me good and with respect. (I’m still working on getting totally over him) But I just said to myself: if I ever start a relationship again, it has to be with someone that makes me feel like this relationship did. Otherwise I won’t do it. I’m not gonna settle for less anymore. And if that means I will never find someone, so be it. Being single and alone is always better than being together alone. I don’t wanna be with someone that makes me feel shitty. I don’t wanna be intimate with someone I don’t have enough feelings for. Then I might as well save myself the effort and just be alone.

  • Caz

    @ Rebecca

    I totally understand what you saying, and I think you have the right attitude. But please can I offer some words of caution with regards to finding men on the internet. Personally, I think that’s a bad way to meet men as they are so many weirdo’s out there searching for naive women to use and exploit. If you post a nice photo of yourself, they are going to be all over you telling you everything you want to hear and if you are lonely and needing love then you will probably fall for it. On my profile it states clearly that I am a lesbian, yet I still have men coming onto me because my picture looks nice. They really don’t care, and it shows that they don’t even read the information on your profile. I would suggest to you that you use a picture (can’t think of the word for them) i.e. a symbol or some sort. Then, if a man approaches you and talks to you without asking to see a picture of you, then you know that there is something special about him and he’s not just another shallow prick. You want to meet a man who is respectful and capable of holding an intelligent conversation which doesn’t include sex. A man who will treat you like a human being and not a piece of meat he wants to have sex with. Also, maybe you could look into finding yourself a hobby or going on some sort of activity which would involve you meeting men. Maybe just look to make friends for now, and then see what happens in the future. But don’t they say, love comes when you stopping looking for it?

    I love being single and I think I’m so lucky that I get to have sex with myself whenever I want, and no man will ever touch me again. My body is all mine. I feel sorry for women who become dependent on men to give them pleasure in the bedroom. Loving and appreciating your body for yourself raises your self-esteem.

  • Rebecca

    @ Caz:

    I know, internet dating is crappy. But sometimes it’s the only solution if you want to have a chance on meeting different kinds of men. I live in a smaller town and the men I want to meet are not really to be found here. And because I don’t feel like going out a few nights per week, only to be in bars and meet shallow losers that only look for sex, this is the only other way to do it. We all know what a woman alone in a bar is considered to be, especially when she’s over 30: lonely, depressed and an easy target. Men will come at you like flies, but it’s not the kind I want to meet. I don’t feel like going there only to tell the men there to back off for 10 times an hour.

    So mostly internet dating is the only acceptable solution, especially since I’m not really a bar type anymore. I have a pretty busy life and when I come home in the evening, I just want to sit on my ass, relax and read a good book, instead of getting pretty, putting up a mask and go on a man hunt. :-)

    The big disadvantage of internet dating indeed, is that there are a lotttt of freaks out there. The majority of men on dating sites really suck. They are only looking for sex, or they are married and hope to find a mistress on the side, or they want to take financial advantage of you, etcetera, etcetera. It’s very shallow and it’s hard to go to a deeper emotionel level with someone if you met him on a dating site.
    I had some good experiences too though, but the most of my dates through internet were crappy. It’s a big meat market, and if you have a date and he thinks you are not perfect, he just goes home to browse other profiles, looking for a girl who is perfect. With a few mouse clicks he has access to thousands of other profiles; so 99% of the men don’t put any effort in one girl anymore.

    The disadvantage of not putting a photo is, that almost no one looks at your profile anymore. I see that for myself. I consider men with no photo to be either fake, or married, or dishonest in some other way. Why else would you not put on a photo? We all want to believe that looks aren’t important, but of course they are important (up to a certain level). If a man without a photo sends me a message, he goes to the not-interested-corner immediately. I just want to know what you look like. I show myself with a photo, so you do the same. If you send me a message, and it turns out that I find you ugly as hell, we would both be wasting our time in continuing the contact, right? I prefer to know that from the start.
    So I can understand that it works the same for men. If a woman has no photo, mostly it’s assumed that she must be 200 kilos, ugly, handicapped or whatever. As nice as your profile text might be, no one will message you.

    So I’ll just leave the photo there. If he’s not capable of holding an intelligent, sexless conversation, you mostly discover that in the first talk already. So that’s mostly fast enough to blow him off: it’s just that it gets pretty annoying after guy number 100000000. :-S

    Wouldn’t it be handier for you just to turn to a lesbian dating site? They do exist, right? At least then you know there’ll be only women and you won’t be bothered by straight men approaching you.

    I know they say that love comes when you stop looking, but I’ve stopped looking in the past, and I still didn’t see it coming yet – so I don’t really know if I still believe in that phrase. :-)

  • Caz

    @ Rebecca

    I totally understand what you are saying. Men in bars are out to look for easy lays. I’m sure most of them aren’t looking for women to go into a relationship with. I have been on a lesbian dating website before and that was also like a meat market and I found it to be shallow and disappointing. I too am not looking for someone to have sex with. Also, I’m really in love with somebody I know, she is very very beautiful, but she has a boyfriend and I don’t think she likes me that way. But it’s cool. Like I say i’m happy being single and just looking to make friends in life.

    I think you are right, you should put a photo up of yourself, and that shows you are honest and genuine. But when you get guys talking about sex to you one minute into your conversation, I think you should be really rude to them and tell them how disgusting you find their behaviour and inappropriate comments. Maybe then they will think twice about how they speak to women. Probably not, but you might feel better. : ))

  • Rebecca

    Haha….yeah, I don’t really think they will take it into consideration, let alone that it opens up their eyes, but still, at least I can get it off my chest. Although I’m taking small steps with it now. I used to be a friendly person, who doesn’t want to hurt people’s feelings, so I’m always careful and thoughtful. I can be rude, but only when someone really gets in my way or something.
    So I never wanted to reject men in a rude way, because I’m not someone who hurts other people’s feelings just for the fun of it. But on the other hand, they don’t consider me or my feelings for a second, so why would I be careful with them?

    You know what is annoying? That if you tell a man the truth about his behaviour, he’ll immediately turn it around and consider you to be a men-hating, frigid bitch full of rage. Everything is always your fault, even when he just plainly offended you. It would never make him think: yeah, she’s right, what the hell was I thinking when I got up to her and treated her like a piece of meat.
    No, it’s always you: you’re the frigid bitch that’s overreacting. I hate that!!

    They always try to make us feel insecure with these lines, because most of us have bad experiences and we think: “Hmm, maybe he’s right, maybe I am reacting like this because I put my former bad experiences on him, maybe I’m prejudiced.” They just try to make us doubt our own feelings with that, so that they don’t have to show decent behaviour. This way they avoid every responsibility. And we let them, because we are basically programmed from birth to be thoughtful, friendly, polite and self-reflecting.

    I once had a drunk man walking by me in a bar, and touching me, and when I smacked him in the face he started to yell that I was a psycho. He totally played innocent and made me look like I was a mentally ill idiot who saw things that weren’t there. They really never look at their own behaviour. Instead of that, they blame the woman.

    Our whole society is filled with it. Only a few decades ago, the woman was blamed when she got raped. In other societies, especially in Middle East and African countries, it’s still like that. Thank God we evaluated a little bit further here, but you can still hear sometimes that ‘she was asking for it’, because she wore too many make-up, a short skirt, a shirt with a cleavage, etcetera.

    They call us women the weaker gender, but I honestly think men are the weaker gender. They can not control their impulses and urges the way we can. When they see a beautiful women, most of them immediately lose their capability of thinking normal. Their dick takes over – and when they do something stupid or harmful, they just blame the woman.

    That’s also why I feel so much reluctance towards islamic countries. Sorry, but muslim men are seriously the worst of all. Their entire religion and culture is filled with gender inequality. Women are worth less then dogs or camels. I’ve travelled from Israel to Jordan last summer, a few days with a female friend to do some sight seeing there, and even though the people were very hospitable and friendly, you could really see that 99% of the men considered us to be ‘easy targets’. Their friendly behaviour really didn’t cover the horniness that lied underneath.
    Another female friend of me lived in Cairo for 6 months, for her internship, and at some point she started to cover herself and wear a headscarf and a long skirt, because she was so sick and tired of all the men harassing her.

    We must really be glad we don’t live in countries like that, because they hide their women to “protect” them against the urges of men. If a man can’t hold himself back, the woman gets blamed because she probably asked for it, or wasn’t properly covered, etcetera. It’s too disgusting for words. If they can see more than only your eyes and hands, they consider it to be an invitation that says “f*ck me”.

    Nice to hear that you are in love. :-) Too bad she has a boyfriend, but still, the fact that you can still feel love for someone is a good sign. At least no one succeeded in destroying that!

    For now, I’m fine with being single too. I still hope it won’t be forever, and that I will meet a good man one day, because I still don’t look forward to die alone, but I’m not in a hurry right now. I want to finish my education first. If I meet a good man in the meantime, it’s nice, but I won’t go looking for it. My study is my first priority for now: I want to have that degree, period.

    I still have feelings for my ex, and I will probably see him again in 2 months from now (he lives in another country then me). So we’ll see what happens. In any case, I said to myself that nothing sexual is going to take place. It will not be easy because I am still very attracted to him, but I have to hold myself back to protect my heart. If there’s not going to be a commitment, there’s not going to be any sex as well. That’s how simple it is.

  • Caz

    You don’t have to travel to a middle eastern country to be treated like that. When I was raped by that sexual harasser at work, some people blamed me. Said I was too friendly, too goodlooking, dressed too sexily, too trusting etc etc. But at the end of the day, he was the one who should have controlled his own sexual disgusting urges. Why the hell should i have to put a sheet over my head to keep sexual harassers from leering at me and thinking they can force me into a relationship with them against my will? I fucking hate that guy.

    Rebecca, I think you are so intelligent and amazing, and I’m so glad you are going to concentrate on finishing your degree. You seem so determined, and no man is going to get in your way. You go girl!!!!

  • Rebecca

    That is so ridiculous….as if being friendly, goodlooking and trusting means an invitation to have sex against your will. Did they really say that straight to your face???

    People really, really don’t get it. And it’s not only men though: this society is full with women who are the first ones to judge other women for being ‘too pretty, too sexy, too friendly’ and calling them whores.

    Indeed, he’s the one that should’ve held himself back. No matter how a woman looks, what she dresses like or how friendly she is, it’s criminal to just assume that it means she wants to have sex with you. Unfortunately I think these tendencies will always be there….society is just easier on men. They are always excused for their behaviour: either it’s called “manly” and people don’t even consider it to be agressive – or when they do, they say “ah well, he’s a man, she probably asked for it, she shouldn’t have provoked him”. Or in other words: if a man gets agressive, he probably has been provoked, and people tell us “you should’ve known that men are like that”. And voila, there’s the excuse for them. Either way, it’s always our fault.

    Sometimes I really think my life would’ve been so much easier if I were a man! You get excused for everything. Even when you’re a young boy. For example, my father never told my brother to help clean the table after dinner. It was always only to me: “Help your mother with cleaning the table, will you?” My brother was never included in that. I didn’t do it either, cause I refused to do it only because it’s some stupid ‘female duty’ or something: my brother had hands too, so why didn’t he have to help?
    Because I was a girl and he isn’t.

    I don’t want to state that my father was a woman-hating jerk in favour of gender inequality, but this example was just to picture how small these things can be and how full our society is with these little things that make women the inferior gender. Mostly people do it without even realizing it. I never had the idea that I was worth less to my father because I was a girl: he loved both me and my brother just as much. But still: he only said to me that I had to help my mother with the dishes or cleaning the table.

    And that’s just only a small example. Our society is much easier on men than it is on women.
    Maybe I should do an MA in Gender Studies after this. :-)

    I totally get you when you say you don’t want to put a sheet over your head to keep men away from you. (and by the way: even then they don’t stay away from you, because sexual harassment is much more common in islamic countries, where the women indeed have a sheet over their head!) So that’s not helping them either. On the contrary: it only makes it worse.

    I don’t want to make myself look ugly and unattractive only because men can’t control their urges – and I think neither should you. Just be yourself and take some Krav Maga lessons to use at the moments when a man really doesn’t take no for an answer. It might be fun to kick the crap out of him. ;-)

  • Caz

    Thanks Rebecca. I actually do kickboxing and other martial arts, and am very fit. If i had been sober at the time, I would have kicked the crap out of him. But he did what he did to me when i was very drunk and unaware of what was going on. He tricked me into going out for a drink with him and some others from work. Pretended he just wanted to be friends. He then spent a whole evening convincing me to go into a relationship with him, and just couldn’t understand why i wasn’t interested. Of course i couldn’t tell him i was a lesbian because i didn’t want other people at my work to find out, so i just told him i wanted to be friends, which was a big mistake. I think he took that as i really fancy you but i don’t want to be in a relationship just yet, or something. He thought about after forcing himself on me, then i would go into a relationship with him. But the next day, after i sobered up i made things very clear to him, and he didn’t like it. He wouldn’t have anything to do with me after that. Then i heard him going around flirting with other women at work, sexually harassing them. Then i knew i had to show all his disgusting emails to management or else he would get away with what he did and put other women through the same hell he put me through. I can’t describe just how disgusting and horrified i felt after having sex with him. I never wanted to have sex with a man. I felt so sick for so long. It really badly messed with my mental frame of mind, and its only now a few months later, that i can actually talk about what happened to me. But i am doing this now cos i want to warn other women about these type of men. If you are being sexually harassed in any way, then please don’t think ignoring it will make it go away. It will only get worse over time and could lead to sexual assault or rape. You have to speak out against it, and have the evidence to back it up. Or else they keep on doing it and its not right. I don’t care what any body says, he raped me and i didn’t deserve that. He just couldn’t take fucking no for an answer. I can’t believe he’s still working at the old people’s home actually. They should have sacked him. Maybe they will in time when he puts another step wrong.

    But i will continue to look good Rebecca. I have high self-esteem. I am proud of myself and my identity now and i don’t hide it anymore. If anything, this experience has made me so much stronger and smarter, and no man will ever ever manipulate me like that again. I don’t drink alcohol anymore either. Men find it very very easy to manipulate women into having sex with them when they are drunk. I hate selfish men who happily go around impregnating innocent women and give them horrific diseases. I’ve been to the police and the doctors since it happened, and i am taking very good care of my health now.

  • Rebecca

    It keeps shocking me that there are really people on this planet who act SO selfish. What a jerk! No means no. Unfortunately there are still a lot of men who think no means a hidden yes. They really think they are gods, and that a woman will change her mind once she slept with him.

    By the way, why couldn’t you tell that you were a lesbian? Is it really such a big thing in America? I’m from Holland, and in my country we are much more liberal with that. People can just openly be gay here. Of course there will be some judgments from people, but it’s not that you’ll be discriminated for it or something. Is it really different in America?

    I have actually thought about the option to just tell a man that I’m a lesbian if I want to get rid of him. I have a good friend who’s a lesbian, and when a man hits on her, she just plainly tells him she’s lesbian – and it really makes me laugh so hard when I see their faces!! Every time again they’re stunned. It’s a big shock to them, to discover that she’s not into men at all. It’s like they are thinking: “How can she not be?!” It’s like their egos are a little bit crushed when she says that. It’s hilarious, believe me.

    So I’ve thought about saying the same, because it’s very effective. They are so shocked that they’re immediately out of words. They just don’t expect a woman to be totally not into men. (because they are so preoccupied with themselves and think every woman kisses their feet)

    A girl at my university is being sexually harassed by one of the professors. She told me a few weeks ago that he’s constantly putting his arm around her shoulders, try to hug her, and he even kissed her on the cheek (and he’s a married man in his 40′s with two children!!). Seriously, he was the last one I expected to do such a thing. I know him pretty well and I never had any alarm bells ringing. Mostly I ‘sense’ it when people are not good, but with him…nothing, never. I was really shocked to hear it.
    Unfortunately she is a very sweet and shy girl, and she doesn’t dare to stand up to him, because she’s afraid it will influence her grades. And she also doesn’t have any proof, because he’s only doing it when they are alone and he’s never sending her emails or something. So it’s her word against his – and we all know who the management board will believe: he is a respectable, friendly, married man with a doctorate, she is a stunningly beautiful student with an immigrant background. She can never win that, and she knows it. The management board will probably think: “She must have done something that made him lose his mind, and looking at her, it’s no wonder: she’s so beautiful that you can’t even blame this man for making the move.” Cause that’s how it goes. They will probably give him some warning, just because that’s the right thing to do, but we all know what they will think secretly, and her life will be hell for the rest of the time she’s studying here.

    You are right, it won’t go away by ignoring it. But men like this, they always know how to pick their victims. He never tried anything with me, for example. Maybe because he’s just not attracted to me, that’s an option of course, but I also think he knows very well that I would cause him a lot of trouble. I’m not the shy, silent sweet-girl-type and he’s very aware of that.

    I don’t drink alcohol either, by the way. I never did. I don’t like the taste, but I also don’t like what it can do to you. It’s pretty disgusting if you see all the men hang around a woman who drank too much: they are like hyenas, circling around their prey, waiting to jump it. Even my father (himself a man) talks about that and he thinks it’s disgusting.
    I never drank because I don’t wanna take the risk to lose control of myself. It’s not safe. There will always be people around you waiting to take advantage of you at such a moment. I don’t want that to happen.

    In my opinion: a good and respectful man wouldn’t even WANT to sleep with a woman who’s too drunk to consent. What’s the fun in that? He’s a low life scumbag for doing what he did. Remember that it says more about him than about you: apparently the only way he can get a woman, is when she’s completely drunk. Sane and sober woman apparently don’t want to sleep with him. How pathetic is that! :-)

  • Caz

    Thank you Rebecca. You are right. He is pathetic, and he thought I was a very easy target when he started picking on me. I myself am quiet, nice and polite. But I don’t take kindly to being abused or harassed, and if i have to, I will stand up for myself. And i will speak out against abuse to make sure it prevents others from going through it too. Just like I think you friend should. She should give the professor a warning and tell him to back off, his behaviour is sexual harassment, and if he’s not careful she should put a complaint in against him, even if she has no proof. She has to stand up for herself because i promise you, these men, just get worse and worse.

    I told my driving instructor i was a lesbian and he continued to sexually harass me. I don’t see him anymore now because of it. I just can’t stand it. I live in a small town where everyone knows each other, and when i come out as a lesbian, people will find it very shocking. It’s a small traditional town.

    I’m so glad you are smart enough not to drink and allow yourself to get drunk. You are right, men are sick and will happily take advantage of women in that state. I like being in control of all my senses now and could drink alcohol again after what happened. Thanks for listening Rebecca and for being so understanding. I’m still waiting for my work to sort out the rape counselling for me. But you have helped me a lot and I do feel a little better now. : )))

  • Rebecca

    You’re more then welcome, I’ve learned a lot from you as well. Too bad you have to ‘hide’ who you really are because of other people’s judgements. Sometimes I really wish people were not so fucking narrow-minded. It’s an exhausting world. Pffff.

  • Caz

    @ Rebecca

    I’m not hiding anymore. I am coming out. I don’t care what anybody thinks of me anymore. If people can accept me for who I am, then great. But if not, then that is their problem. But I am going to be who i really am now, and be happy about it. When one can truly accept themselves for who they are, then they don’t require acceptance from others. xx

  • Rebecca

    That’s right! You go, girl!

  • Annie

    @Rebecca

    Your statement rings sooo true.

    “You know what is annoying? That if you tell a man the truth about his behaviour, he’ll immediately turn it around and consider you to be a men-hating, frigid bitch full of rage. Everything is always your fault, even when he just plainly offended you. It would never make him think: yeah, she’s right, what the hell was I thinking when I got up to her and treated her like a piece of meat.
    No, it’s always you: you’re the frigid bitch that’s overreacting. I hate that!!”

    I rejected a man recently. We’d been flirting a bit and it was nice. Then he propositioned me, I said no. For a while it was just mild insults(which I chose to read at the time as teasing). 18 m onths later, he was still propositioning me and was also engaged to be married.

    When I finally told him what I thought, he called me a man-hater, negative and told me I was going to be a really, really lonely old woman. LOL!!

    The sad part is, so many women put up with this behaviour because they want a “guy”. Being single, choosing it and not trying to get a man is incredibly liberating given the options available.

    Men want intimacy and they don’t want to earn it, by getting to know you and choosing to spend time with you.

    I think another problem with “women as objects” is that way too many men these day’s watch porn. As much as they boo-hoo you if you are against it, the truth is it is incredibly destructive to the male Psyche. Within a few hours of watching Porn a man’s perceptions of females change. This is tested through brain-imaging so the science now backs us up on what Porn does to men.

    They think women are ready, hot, available, willing and love being degraded.

    So if I ever did meet a man I liked again, Porn would be out. If he watches it, he’s not for me.

  • Rebecca

    @ Annie:
    Okay, so if I understand you correctly, he was hitting on you while he was engaged to someone else?? That’s disgusting. What on earth makes him think you would ever fall for a “man” like that?

    I had the man-hater-speech many times before. Every time you confront a man with inappropriate behaviour, you will get the same lines. Either in your face, or else they do it behind your back.

    I only had a guy hitting on me, on the street, from out of his car, while I was walking on the side walk. He tried to make a conversation with me and invited me to come sit with him in his car. I told him in a polite way that I wasn’t interested and that I had a boyfriend (which was actually true). And he just started to tell me that I didn’t have a boyfriend, that I was lying, etcetera. Really, he just said “no, you don’t have a boyfriend, I always see you walking here alone, you are lying to me”. (well…if that’s the case: take a hint, loser) Seriously, I was stunned. In the end he yelled at me that I was arrogant and that I would die alone. Only because I rejected him. How pathetic can you be?!

    The sad truth is indeed, that a lot of women put up with the crappy way they are being treated by men. That’s also the main reason why men can be like this: because WE allow them to! That should change, but unfortunately I don’t think it will happen. We can never arrange for all the women in the world to gain some dignity. There will always be girls with such low self esteem that they think having a crappy relationship is better than being alone. They comfort themselves by saying “every relationship has its problems”, “he’s nog so bad”, “he doesn’t mean it”, “he does love me” or “at least he’s not beating me” – and they hang on.

    I don’t think we can all blame it just on porn. To be honest, I’ve watched porn as well, and sometimes I still do. There’s a lot of different kinds of porn, so I don’t think it’s scientifically correct to say that all porn has the same effect on every man or woman. If men watch extremely violent porn, I can relate to the fact that their perceptions of females change, but if you love violent porn, I think you were not really sane to begin with.

    I think the objectification of women has various reasons. First of all, emancipation played a big part in it. Don’t forget ours is the first generation after the emancipation processes of the 60′s, 70′s and 80′s. We are the first generation that has to find love within a new setting of roles between men and women.
    In the generation of our parents and grandparents, it was easier. Men as well as women knew exactly what their roles were. He worked and made the money, she stayed home and took care of the children. I don’t want to say that everything was good then, but things were clear for both genders.

    Now everything changed. Women no longer need men to take care of us financially. We don’t depend on them for food, clothing, housing, etcetera. We are allowed to work and make our own money. We go to school and have good educations. We have equal rights by law.
    I honestly think that most men have no idea what to be for us anymore. I think the fact that we emancipated, has made them lose a lot of power. Power they were used to have for centuries – and now suddenly they don’t have it anymore. In the early days, you used to be a real man if you took care of your wife and family. That was your main goal in daily life. But now it’s not like that anymore. And because they lost that power over us, I think they feel useless, because they really don’t see what they can be for us now that they can’t be the care takers anymore.

    Second problem is: we can’t look to our parents and grandparents to see examples of this new role pattern, because we don’t have any comparisations. Most of our parents and grandparents had traditional marriages, where the man made the money and the woman was a housewife and mother.

    So we have to figure all these new roles out by ourselves. I once read this theory in a book and it made sense to me.

    Men used to control us by being the ones providing for our daily lives, by making the money for our food, clothing, housing, etcetera. Now that they don’t have any control over us anymore in that area, they feel like they are not needed. The only way they have left now to take back the power they once had over us, is by degrading us. They can’t control our life, so they want to control our emotions. It’s the only way they can get to us and gain some sort of power to feel manly.

    Because actually, I think deep down inside they fear us. They oppressed us all these centuries for a reason. In all the world religions, women are considered to be dangerous creatures, who will bring a man down if he gives them too much power over him. World religions talk about women who need to be protected from all the evil things that can happen to them – but at the same time they impute destructive powers to us. Main message: if you don’t oppress a woman, she will eventually destroy you. She needs to be controlled.

    And even though the process of secularisation started a long time ago, that thought is still valid. Most men are not even aware of it, but it’s still valid. They used to be able to control us by being our provider. Now that we no longer need them for that, they’ve run out of ways to control and oppress us.

    We broke free. And it scares the shit out of them, I honestly believe that. Cause we still hear men make jokes among each other, jokes with the underlying message that you are wasted if you really give your heart to a woman. We all know the jokes that a man’s friends can make when he gets married: she lured you in, now you’re lost, this is the end of the fun life, she will control you, etcetera, etcetera. Like his life ends now that he gets married, like it can only get worse from now because he gave his heart to a woman. He’s “lost”, his life is over.

    It’s just jokes, but they carry some partial truth in them. I really do think that men are scared of us, because what do you do when you are scared of somebody? You try to oppress that person. You try to prevent that they get too much power over you, because you’re afraid they will destroy you.
    If they wouldn’t fear us, there would be no need for oppression. But subconsciously, they known damn well that we are mentally stronger. It’s for a reason that women are the ones giving birth to children. A man would never be able to stand the pain of labour, they are too weak for that. If men had to give birth, no new babies would be born.
    It’s for a reason that women live longer than men. If a couple has been married for a lot of years, and the woman dies, the man will mostly die not too long after that. He just can’t be alone. And if he stays alive, in many cases we will see a sad creature, neglecting himself, counting the days till his life ends.
    When the man dies first, you see in many cases that the woman is much better at living alone. Of course she will miss him, of course she will feel empty because she lost her mate, but in many cases you see her making the best of it. I’ve seen women who outlived their husbands for 10 or 20 years and who did fine on their own. Men really need us more than we need them.

    Third, I think it’s really a shame that a lot of parents don’t educate their children properly anymore. Many parents are too busy with themselves to look after their children and teach them some respect for others. I’m pretty sure that my father would be seriously furious at my brother if he would find out that my brother cheats on his girlfriend, or beats her, or do other bad things to her. My brother was always raised to treat women with respect: just because that’s how you need to treat people.
    I think society became incredibly selfish the last decades. People don’t care for others anymore: they only care about their own needs and satisfactions. As long as there’s profit in it for them, they don’t give a shit if they hurt other people. Our society is very materialistic and individualistic. Parents should raise their children more properly and make sure they have a conscience, instead of telling them “do whatever feels right for you”. Children should learn that not everything is about them in this world.

    The objectification of women is also a result of that. If men would learn that women are not just things only for their pleasure, maybe things would go better. But because many parents don’t teach their children consciousness anymore, and put them in front of these sexist video clips on MTV so that they’re not bothered by their children, men really think that women only live to please them, and that you throw your woman away when she demands that you treat her with respect.

    Porn is just a little part of the whole objectification. A little part of a much, much bigger picture, I think. A symptom of something bigger that lies underneath.

  • Annie

    Lol Rebecca!!

    That comment is so typical. If you reject a man, he tells you that you will be a very lonely old woman and die. Pure projection. Single women in fact form great intimate friendships with other women and men, and hence stave off loneliness a lot better than men do.

    You are right in that there are different types of porn. A lot of porn however does degrade and objectify females and males for that matter. It does affect the brain, and the more you watch it, the worse it becomes. Lookup porn addiction. It’s rather scary to be honest. It’s why I don’t look at it anymore.

    I’m not morally opposed to porn, and it can be fun if managed correctly, but it’s something both men and women actually should be careful about. Especially exposing young males to it.

    Your other comments, yes the power has shifted. Imo, the primary reason for oppression of females, was due to sexual repression. This came from fears of male paternity.Female sexuality was repressed to ensure males knew that they were the fathers. Everything came from this place. It may have even made sense in terms of creating a stable society, but it no longer holds any weight, especially with DNA testing for paternity.

    Men continually and consistantly shame women into behaving the way they want them to. Men spread their seed, but women are sluts. When men sleep around its just because they want a bit of variety, when women do it, they are immorral, etc etc etc. All of it is an attempt to force monogamy onto females, including depending on a male for survival and being “owned” by him.

    Yes, I think men are afraid and intimidated by women. But that’s a big discussion..haha!!

    And yes, society has become selfish. We have raised a generation of very shallow, selfish people. This is actually sad, as people are lonely, they do not know how to form intimate trusting relationships anymore, and they tend to just use each other for what they want.

    Oh well, can’t change others. Can only change oneself.

  • Caz

    I agree with you both, Rebecca and Annie. What you said about men reminds me of my own traumatic experience when i was sexually harassed by that guy at work who eventually raped me. When we were out that night, he kept trying to convince me that I should go into a relationship with him. He said he really cared about me and just wanted to make me happy. I told him I loved being single. I have lots of friends, great jobs and loads going for me. I don’t need a man to tie me down and make me feel like shit. In my experiences from the past, all the men i’ve been with only wanted to control me and knock my self-esteem. One man even tried to make me kill myself with his mental abuse.

    Anyway, when i made it very clear to him that i did not want to go into a relationship with him or any man, he then proceeded to tell me how i should feel very flattered to be getting so much attention from him. That guy was so arrogant, egocentric and in love with himself. He just could not comprehend the idea that i wasn’t interested in him in that way. How can it be possible for an ugly man like him to think he is so goodlooking? God he needs to buy a mirror! Anyway, he then told me that i was getting old and no other man would be interested in going into a relationship with me based on my age (30) and because i’ve had a bad past, which i stupidly told him about, in the hope it would make him back off and leave me alone. He just tried his best all night to make me feel like i should be so lucky to be with a god like him.

    The next morning, after he’d raped me, he then had the cheek to comment that i was very inexperienced in bed and needed a lot of practice. He tried to say i was crap in bed! He couldn’t seem to see that was probably because he’d raped me when i was drunk and didn’t actually fucking fancy the bastard. I didn’t want to be with him in that way. Then, when he walked me to the bus stop the next day, he started to tell me how to grow my hair, how to act around others, change my personality etc. I turned around and told him, “Don’t you try to change me in any way. I like myself just the way I am” – he didn’t like that at all. I don’t why he’d convinced himself that i was shy and quiet and could be controlled like that. I am actually a very assertive, confident person and i am sure of myself, and when he realised that, then he told me a few days later that he wasn’t interested in going into a relationship with me after all. For months, I was left to feel like complete shit about myself. I even became suicidal because of it all, especially when i had to tell management at work all about him. But i had to cos i heard he was going around sexually harassing other women.

    What have i learned from my experiences? 1. Don’t tell a man anything about yourself. Especially not your bad past, because they will use it against you to further manipulate you. 2. Never drink alcohol. Men love to manipulate women when they are drunk and find it very easy to take advantage of them. 3. You can’t ignore sexual harassment cos it just gets worse and can lead to rape. 4. Men will tell you anything and everything they think you want to hear just so they can you get you into bed but that don’t actually give a shit about you or care what you want. 5. Men don’t seem to mind if a woman isn’t sexually attracted to them, they will still try to manipulate you by making you feeling sorry for them. They would be happy for you to go into a relationship with them based on pity, how fucking pathetic! 6. If a man asks you if you have a boyfriend, try these suggestions:-

    * why do you want to know?
    * yes, i do have a boyfriend (then don’t give any more info)
    * I am currently in a very happy stable relationship (with yourself)
    * that is a very personal question, and i don’t have to answer it
    * if you don’t stop sexually harassing me, I will report you

    Can anyone think of any more suggestions to deal with these idiot creeps?

  • Rebecca

    @ Annie:
    Yes, the double standards for men and women are well-known. A man having sex with a lot of women is manly, a woman having sex with a lot of men is a slut. A man behaving dominant and agressive is manly, a woman is a bitch. A man that acts irresponsible ‘has managed to keep the child in him’, a woman is selfish. A gay man is just gay, a gay woman is considered to be able to convert back to men when she meets the right one.

    I talked about that last part yesterday with my brother. He agreed with me. A woman who’s boyfriend turns out to be gay, is not blamed. When a man’s girlfriend turns out to be lesbian, he did something wrong and other men make a little bit fun of him. After all, his girlfriend didn’t ‘turn’ into a lesbian for nothing, so he must’ve been not good in bed or anything.
    When men talk about lesbian women, you often hear the phrase “she’s a lesbian, but that’s because she didn’t have ME yet”. In other words: if she has a good man, she will change her mind. They just can’t imagine that a woman is totally not into them! How arrogant is that?
    You will never hear a woman say: “Oh, he is gay? That’s only because he didn’t sleep with me yet.” We are not like that.

    Oppression of women happened in a lot of ways. Not only sexual, but also social. The witch trials, where so many women were burned, were not because they really had magical powers or something. These women were burned because they didn’t fit in socially: single older women, living alone, keeping to themselves…and because of that they were feared. Something had to be wrong with them. A woman who’s not controlled by a man, can only mean something dangerous. The amount of men that were burned during the witch trials is very, very minimal. It were almost all women.
    And history has a lot more examples of male oppression against us.

    @ Caz:
    Another suggestion would just be: I’m a lesbian, haha.

    You are right when you say that it’s better not to tell a man anything about yourself. Sooner or later they will use it against you.

    The guy at your work needs a bitch who shows him his place. I really hope for him to meet one someday. One who clearly shows him what a piece of crap he is. Let’s all hope that will happen.

  • Caz

    @ Rebecca

    I know I could tell a sexual harasser that I am a lesbian, but that doesn’t stop them. And like you said before, they will just say, oh, she hasn’t been with me yet. If she met the right guy who was good in bed, then she would stop being a lesbian and turn straight. They really don’t have any brains do they. It’s just so unbelievable how stupid they really are. Penis brains!

    You are right about society and the government’s. It encourages young women to go out there, find Mr Right, have babies, and focus her life around raising her family. Our education and careers aren’t seen as that important as the Men’s. It’s all about men, it really is a man’s world. They are allowed to be single independent and focus on their career. It is perfectly acceptable for them to be selfish and sleep around with different women. But if a woman acts like that, people are shocked and can’t understand it. Well, I for one love being a selfish independent woman who only focuses on my career, and maybe I’ll sleep around with other women! I don’t give a shit about men and relationships, and it so liberating and empowering to be like that you know. I don’t live by society’s rules, i live by my own. I live my self for myself, and for nobody else. : )))

    I think I was a complete bitch to that guy actually. You should have seen what I wrote about him in my complaint! Many people at my work think I’m a complete bitch, and I’m happy about that cos I’m sick of being treated like miss nice girl who can be walked all over. I’m nobody’s doormat.

  • Rebecca

    It’s totally true, men are allowed to do things that women aren’t allowed to do. They are encouraged for it and we are judged.

    Their life is so easy. I often hear a lot of guys say “I want 3 children” (or even 4). And then it makes me think: “Yeah, easy for you to say, your life isn’t gonna change!” They want so much, but at the same time most of them refuse to take responsibility.
    They are not the ones giving up their job. They are not the ones staying at home to take care of the kids. No wonder it’s easy to say you want 3 or 4. You don’t have to give up anything for it.

    It doesn’t matter if a woman is just as educated (or even more educated) than them: she is the one who gives up her career, he won’t. It’s nice that she has studied, but as soon as the children come into the picture, she’s the one that has to take a step back and give up herself and her life. While he’s the one whose life doesn’t change: he still goes to work every morning, and in the evening he comes home and he has to do nothing anymore. During weekends he can show off with his pretty wife and their adorable children, without sacrificing anything for it.

    If a man is single for a long period, nobody will tell him that he has to hurry. Nobody will even think it’s sad for him. Everybody thinks: “Of course the guy doesn’t wanna give up his freedom, he’s totally right to live for himself!” Cause women are considered to be bitchy creatures that only take away a man’s freedom. When a man gets married, he only has something to lose.

    When a woman is single, people look at her like she’s a little bit pathetic. They say “she probably can’t get a man, poor thing”. And when she’s over 35, most people consider her to be an ‘old maid’, and they start to think something must be wrong with her. Cause if there wasn’t something wrong with her, she would’ve been married by now, right?

    That’s how society looks at men and women. We talk about equality, but things are far from equal. The double standards are more around then you might think. I can give tons of examples of that.

    About the lesbian-excuse: no, with sexual harassers it’s probably not gonna work. But you can always kick them in the balls if nothing helps. ;-)

  • Caz

    Thanks Rebecca. But I have to say I don’t think a single independent woman over 30 is pathetic. I really look up to career women who are out for themselves. I think they are so amazing. What I think is pathetic is a woman who has given everything up for some ungrateful man to have babies with him, only to realise that she married a complete loser who won’t help her with anything, and she has to spend the rest of her life with him. Now that is so sad. I feel sorry for women who are married to selfish men who don’t appreciate their wives and their children. They take them for granted and then act all shocked and horrified when their woman meets a new man who can appreciate her. He then calls her all the names under the sun and turns into satan. Then intent on ruining her life and the lives of their children. Now that is very very sad.

    Selfish career women – I love them. I worship them. They are so amazing. They don’t need men for anything, and men can’t stand it. They can’t stand the thought that a woman doesn’t need them for anything. Men need to feel all powerful and like they are in control of their women. But for career women, men are unneeded, useless, insignificant.

  • Rebecca

    Well, I’m a bit more nuanced with that. I do like career women and I would never consider giving up everything for a man, only to become a housewife and have a few babies. I didn’t study for nothing! If I wanted that kind of life, I might as well quit university right now, because my degree will be useless anyway.

    But on the other hand, I would like to be with a good man. Not right now on this very moment, but in the future. I still don’t look forward to grow old alone or something, it would be nicer to be together with somebody and have a nice relationship. Of course, if it’s not in the cards, then I rather stay alone than be with someone who doesn’t make me happy – but if it was totally up to me, I would love to have the best of both worlds: a nice job ánd a loving husband. :-)

    What you wrote indeed sounds horrible: giving up everything for a man that doesn’t appreciate you and takes you for granted. The nightmare! That’s even worse than dying alone.

    I think a lot of men take their women for granted though. I saw it happen soooo many times. They chase the girl, and as soon as they lured her in, they sit back and relax, and they think a relationship doesn’t need any maintenance anymore. I know from my own experiences how unloved that makes you feel. A lot of men are spoiled little boys, who see their girlfriend in the same way as they would see a new TV. In the beginning it’s all nice and fun, and they can’t take off their attention from it, but after a while, it starts to become normal and they take it for granted that it’s there. I think it’s the pitfall of many, many men. And then they are shocked and surprised if their woman falls in love with someone else.
    I would never justify cheating, under no circumstances at all, because no matter what kind of reason she has, it’s wrong – but I must say that I do understand it when a woman that’s been neglected for years falls in love with another man. (nevertheless, she should tell that to her husband and leave him before starting a relationship with the new guy though)

    I think career women are doing a great job, but don’t underestimate that many of them are unhappy and lonely. Because in the end, I think almost everybody wants to find her mate. Every human being wants to find someone they can be happy with.
    Some of these career women even choose for their career because they gave up on men, and the focus on their career was the only alternative to not be bored and lonely. It might sound shitty, but a career only is not always completely sanctifying. I would love it to have a great job, do what I like and what I’m good at – but to be honest, I definitely don’t look forward to come home in an empty house every evening. It’s nice to succeed in building your dreams, but it’s even more nice if you have someone to share it with.

    I would not give up my life for an unsatisfying relationship, but I just hope that someday I will meet a good person. I think there’s nothing wrong with wanting a man in your life, as long as you only settle for the right one, and not for less because of the fact that you don’t want to be alone instead.

  • Caz

    The only one who I will ever love is God. I won’t ever be with a man again. I can’t wait to spend the rest of my life being single and alone. But I will never be lonely. I will have a great career, lot of friends, and a life full of interesting activities. I am alone, yet very happy. So much more happier than i ever was when i was in a pointless relationship with a man. You are right, once a woman goes into a relationship with a man, he soon starts to see her as part of the furniture, and takes her for granted leading her to feel rubbish with low self-esteem. Many women are terrified of being single and are so worried about what their peers will think of them. They go to desperate lengths to find a man, nothing too special, just someone who is willing to go into a relationship with them. Why? They fear what others will think of them. They are terrified of labels being put on them. They need to appear normal and as if they are capable of finding a man who wants to be with them. God, i feel so sorry for them. They don’t know what they are letting themselves in for.

    Rebecca, I really really hope you find the man you’re looking for. I hope he is good with principles and knows how to treat a woman right and with respect. Best of luck to you. But in the meantime, I’m glad you are concentrating on yourself and your studying. That is what really matters at the end of the day. You have yourself, and you are all you’ll ever need and require. Once a woman learns to really love herself, maybe that is when Mr Right will come along. Or is that what the romance novels like to lead us to believe ?

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